Alabama Governor’s Race: The Roy Moore Argument for Execution of Homosexuals

“The State carries the power of the sword, that is, the power to prohibit conduct with physical penalties, such as confinement and even execution. It must use that power to prevent the subversion of children toward this [homosexual] lifestyle, to not encourage a criminal lifestyle.”

The quotation above is not from Fred “God Hates Fags” Phelps, but from Alabama Republican gubernatoral candidate Roy Moore. The context is Ex parte H.H., where the former Alabama Supreme Court Chief Justice tackled the issue of whether homosexual parents have the same rights as their straight former partners. I added the emphasis.

In this case, Moore cited biblical passages as part of his concurrence:

Homosexuality is strongly condemned in the common law because it violates both natural and revealed law. The author of Genesis writes: “God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them…. For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.” Genesis 1:27, 2:24 (King James). The law of the Old Testament enforced this distinction between the genders by stating that “[i]f a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination.” Leviticus 20:13 (King James).

From the passage in Leviticus 20:13, the early western legal tradition garnered its laws on homosexuality. The Corpus Juris Civilis is the sixth-century encyclopedic collection of Roman laws made under the sponsorship of Emperor Justinian. “It is Justinian’s collection which served as the basis of canon law (the law of the Christian Church) and civil law (both European and English).” (9) The following is a statement in Law French from Corpus Juris:

“‘Sodomie est crime de majeste vers le Roy Celestre,’ and [is] translated in a footnote as ‘Sodomy is high treason against the King of Heaven.’ At common law ‘sodomy’ and the phrase ‘infamous crime against nature’ were often used interchangeably.”

In case any of you aren’t familiar with the passage Moore used, here’s the entire verse Moore quoted (NIV and emphasis added). It exposes the part of “early western legal tradition” that Moore purposefully omitted.

If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

As it’s an election year, one might expect Moore to waffle a bit on this one. It’s been reported that he’s done so in the past. There may be some argument over translation of the Leviticus verse (which is why I used a link which provides multiple translations) in question. There can be no argument that Moore also used this non-biblical argument to support his call for execution, though (emphasis added):

Sodomy was codified by statute as a serious crime early in England. “The earliest English secular legislation on the subject dates from 1533, when Parliament under Henry VIII classified buggery (by now a euphemism for same-sex activity, bestiality, and anal intercourse) as a felony. Penalties included death, losses of goods, and loss of lands.”

That Moore finds homosexuality abominable is Moore’s personal right. That Moore would write that the state has and “must use” the power of the sword to protect children from the influence of homosexuals clearly indicates that he’s not suitable to hold any public office — no matter your political party, philosophical ponderings or personal preferences.

If executing gay people isn’t bad enough, the situation could become even scarier if Moore is elected. To defend his position in this case, Moore wrote:

Lest there be any doubt, the Legislature made it clear that its definition of “deviate sexual intercourse” in § 13A-6-65(a)(3) “[made] all homosexual conduct criminal.” Commentary to § 13A-6-65 (emphasis added). (5)

Footnote (5) provides:

5. Section 13A-6-60 defines “deviate sexual intercourse” as “[a]ny act of sexual gratification between persons not married to each other involving the sex organs of one person and the mouth or anus of another.

In other words, he’ll likely stick it to heterosexuals, too. According to Alabama code (pertinent definitions here), it’s a crime for a 15 year and 11 month old teenager to receive oral sex from a 16 year and 1 month old. It’s also a crime, under any circumstances, for any person to give or recieve oral sex outside of the marital bedroom.

Some form of the word “moral” appears 32 times in a document supposedly about a decision based on the law, and not on Moore’s religious beliefs. Additionally, he finds no problems with laws dealing with “moral turpitude” and wrote that common law arguments from centuries ago (unless a state law has been passed which directly addresses the issue at hand) should be the basis for determining criminal responsibility in such cases.

Based on his own words, we now know that Moore would execute homosexuals if state law allowed for it. We don’t yet know how far he’d take it if our teenagers get caught engaged in some heavy petting or if an unmarried couple is exposed for having oral sex. I don’t wish to ever have to find out, either.

Earlier today, I outlined the key choices for Governor of Alabama. If you support killing fags, there’s but one choice for Governor. There are a variety of choices for the rest of you, though.

If you’re socially liberal, you can vote for Nall or perhaps Siegelman. If you’re economically liberal, vote for one of the three tax and spenders: Riley, Baxley or Siegelman. If you’re a true economic conservative who deplores the moral position taken by Roy Moore, Nall is the only choice available. What ever you do, please cast your vote (or your support, if you live outside of Alabama) against Moore.

Props.

34 Comments
  1. He has articulated the standard correctly. The church of the Lord Jesus Christ at Topeka has insisted upon this standard for years, but this evil nation will not obey the word of God. Based upon our experience at the Westboro Baptist Church with the coward Roy Moore, who is ashamed of the Gospel, he will cave in on this.

  2. There’s no question that Nall would be more fun to be around. I’m impressed with the way she reaches out to win over her opponents. Contrast that with the “put-your-opponents-in-jail” approach.

  3. Jonathan,

    Are you the same Jonathan (sp?) Phelps who was quoted as justifying beating your wife and children?

    “Jonathon Phelps, who admits he beats his wife and four children, for emphasis reads from Proverbs, 13:24: “He that spareth his rod, hateth his son. But he that loveth him, chasteneth him betimes.”

    If so, what is the correct spelling of your name — and is the quotation accurate?

  4. I don’t think that the members of the Westboro Baptist Church are tech-savvy enough to use computers.

  5. Nonetheless: “Jonathan Baxter Phelps (lawyer, born c. 1959), son of Fred Phelps, and Paulette Phelps (Ossiander) (high school graduate, born c. 1960), wife of Jonathan Phelps (Jonathan and Paulette were disfellowshipped from Westboro, see below, but were readmitted in 1988). Jonathan is considered to be the Phelps child most like his father in terms of being confrontational with opponents; he is reported to be highly vulgar in such dealings.”

    Perhaps a lawyer is intelligent enough to use a computer, albeit a member of Westboro.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Members_of_Westboro_Baptist_Church#The_Phelpses

  6. The Bible citation is accurate. The remainder of the information is inaccurate or a lie. Inaccurate in that
    the verse reads as follows: Proverbs 13:24: “He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.” Otherwise the remainder of the pretended quote is a lie if it pretends to quote me. You trolls better get better source material. Jonathan Phelps.

  7. Mr. Phelps,

    Let me rephrase, then. Do you, or have you, beaten your wife or children and used any scripture to justify your actions?

  8. This guy is sick. Jeez! However, we must not forget that many Democratic candidates have an awful record on homosexuality, from denying marriage all the way to flat out homophobia. In the last campaign, I handed out flyers in the Castro, the gay district of San Franciso. It was amazing to see how many people thought that John Kerry had a pro-gay-marriage stance. Tee hee =)

  9. I’m not sure which state is dumber – Alabama (where I live) or Texas (where I’ve been known to drink).

    We’ve got to keep these fools out of power.

  10. God, guns, and gays — the trinity of so-called values issues that Southern Republicans have perfected to hammer liberal opponents.”

    Roy Moore has finally figured out how to combine three of the GOPs core issues into one. God decrees gun down gays

  11. I love it when Nazis, I mean so-called Christians, attempt to legislate their own interpretation of the Bible. I wonder if Mr. Moore is attempting to bring back Hitler’s Nazi Party, create his own sect of the KKK, build a militia unit, wanting to bring back the CSA (Confederate States of America), or so desparately wants his own AG congregation. Translation: Mr Moore and his ideals make Hitler, Jesse Helms, Richard Nixon, David Duke, Eric Rudolph, Timothy McVeigh, and Tom Wells look like hippie flower children at Woodstock.

  12. Mr. Phelps,

    Let me rephrase, then. Do you, or have you, beaten your wife or children and used any scripture to justify your actions?

    Comment by Stephen Gordon — 2006-03-23 @ 3:44 pm

    Is his IP from wherever that nutcase is from? (Nigel)

    p)If the answer is yes, hopefully next year his IP will be Inmate of Penitentiary, not internet protocol.

    His ministry is more needed there, anyway, since the restricted availability of women has been known to cause some Christian brothers to go astray and tempt God’s wrath.

  13. If you’re economically liberal, vote for one of the three tax and spenders: Riley, Baxley or Siegelman.

    Not the best choice of words. Modern liberals, while remaining somewhat socially liberal, at least in some cases, are not economically liberal at all. Fiscally liberal (as in free-spending regimists) might be accurate, however.

    In practical terms, our ostensible conservative leaders at both the State level (Riley with his billion dollar tax increase) and national (Dubai-ya has grown spending faster than any white house resident since LBJ) are even more fiscally liberal (economically statist) than the so-called liberals.

  14. Nall should make women’s rights part of her campaign – Moore isn’t going to.

    Comment by Nigel Watt

    paul) She has already made courageous stances on behalf of women’s right to bear breasts (which may not be infringed, since a well-fed infant-ry is essential to the security of a free state) and not to wear panties, even when visiting male inmates in prison.

    Additionally, the Alabama Libertarian Party shows understanding of the plight of women and supports their natural rights and yearning (for justice) by advocating the legalization of vibrators and other dildos.

    Finally, Loretta and the LP of Alabama are opposed to making it legal for husbands to beat their wives (except as part of concensual S&M activities) no matter what the Bible may be construed to say, even by such noted theologians as the Phelps family.

  15. I hate it when some “whacko” so-called Christians give the rest of us Christians a bad name. It just makes non-Christians (and I would have to say many libertarians) generalize and say all Christians believe in the crap that Mr. Moore is spouting. I am a Christian, but my God is a god of love, not of hate. People who kill in gods name are not Christians in my book.

    It seems to me that Ms. Nall would be a great governor compared to your other choices. She at least seems to be for individual choice in many matters including religon. At least she doesn’t seem to take everything so seriously. She would be fun to watch and I bet she would get her hands dirty and get some things done. She doesn’t seem to be the type to bow down to powerful interest groups and other people in power. If people could get beyond her boobs, no-panties, and supposedly one issue candidacy I bet they would find a person that believes much of what they do and will actually fight for their individual rights

  16. Terry, I agree 100% on both your points. It’s good to hear from a real follower of Jesus instead of the power-mongers trying to use His name for their own personal advancement.

    As for Loretta, you’re absolutely right, but the more we mention boobs, no panties, and marijuana, the more hits we’ll get from search engines, and if even just a few of the people looking for tit-illation will stick around long enough, they’ll learn something – and maybe get the word out, too.

  17. Paulie

    I agree with you. I believe her boobs and no-panties will bring her a lot of attention. If that is what it takes to get someone interested in voting for her, great.

    If she can get enough attention from those “personal” issues as well as other issues she may actually have a chance at doing some damage in the governors race. In fact if I had to pick between backing her campaign or a national campaign I pick her’s because if she is elected she will actually have a chance to make a much larger difference that we could use as an example for the larger libertarian movement. I actually think the LP should focus a lot more on governors races with credible candidates in states we can make at least a good showing. If we could actually get a libertarian elected governor who can get things done at the state level, is likeable to the general public, and isn’t unrealistic in there proposals the libertarian movement will take giant steps forward in the eyes of the general public.

  18. Nigel-

    Nutcase? Maybe. I do use strong language in my rhetoric, and also am influenced by past experiences. In short, Ive had more than enough personal negative experiences with people and “friends” on the “conservative” side. Also, my reference about the Nazi party had more to do with their ideology, and not the fact that they were the “bad guys” in the 1930s and 1940s. I guess Im way too fired up about the Libertarian Party and in the hope that we’ll have a Libertarian as President one day soon.

  19. Dude, chill, you sound like a nutcase too. Nazi references never improve your argument.

    Yeah, using a Nazi reference on a subject about the genocide of homosexuals is crazy. After all, that’s only EXACTLY WHAT THEY FUCKING DID!

  20. Let’s see…Roy Moore’s going to execute gays…Christians are Nazis, somebody is a wife-beater (and somehow this helps your case), Nall has nice tits and therefore should be Governor of Alabama…If you believe this shit, no wonder you people don’t have any political clout–you’re much, much stupider than anyone in Alabama or Texas. Stick to butt-fucking and stay the hell out of areas that you’re completely ignorant about.

  21. Joe,

    It seems that you are the one with phobic tendencies. Homophobic, that is.

    Which areas was I not clear about? Are you disputing the documented quotes from court records?

    BTW, I live in Alabama and have spent a whole lot of time in Texas. I know stupid when I see it.

  22. Stephen,

    What’s your definition of phobic? I used the term gays, not fags…I just disagreed with you…does that make me phobic? You’re quoting court records and somehow this is true? I guess you think O.J. was not guilty. You’re living in la-la land and again, stick to butt-fucking because you have no clue what you’re talking about. I’ve been to Alabama too and now that I see you live there, I guess Alabamian’s are stupider than I thought. Perhaps you should move to Texas?

  23. I’m arguing that the transcriptionist was probably accurate, and the case has now been reviewed by many other attorneys and courts without complaint about the wording used.

    I think OJ was probably guilty, BTW.

    How does using “gays”, as opposed to “fags”, make you less phobic? I’m straight, BTW. You are the one who brought up anal sex.

  24. Homosexuality is a sin like any other. Lying, cheating, stealing, and sleeping with someone of the same sex is all the same. Since this be the case, should liars, cheaters, and stealers be executed? I think not.

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