The Republican Hawk Caucus

Two items arrived in my inbox within minutes of each other. The first was a post from RedState:

I know many of you are aware of the Republican Liberty Caucus. Others are not. I toyed with becoming a Libertarian for awhile about 6 months ago. Even to the point of throwing a very small amount of money toward the Libertarian Party one day. Then, I found these guys… and remembered that 3rd parties are a waste of time and money, except in certain local arenas (and not mine- VERY red state here in the military heavy Gulf Coast of NW Florida). The only way to win is fight from within. Just in case some of you haven’t heard of these guys, take a look at the site and see if you like it. Cheers!

The second was an e-mail from Eric Dondero to his so-called republican-liberarians list:

It saddens me greatly to see Ron Paul taking the position he is taking on the War in Iraq. As many of you know I served as Ron’s Travel Aide in his 1988 Libertarian Presidential Campaign. I then went on to serve as his Campaign Coordinator in his 1996 Congressional run, and Senior Aide in his Congressional office from 1997 – 2003. I resigned from Ron’s employ in 2003, mostly due to our severe differences on foreign policy. But since then, I’ve still respected his views on such matters.

However, the other day, driving through Western Montana I caught a CBS News Report. Bob Schieffer led into the report with something to the effect; “but not all Republicans agree that the War in Iraq was a good idea…” What followed were virulent Anti-War comments by Ron Paul on the House Floor.

It’s one thing to be an Anti-War Libertarian. It’s quite another to be used by the Leftist Media as a stooge against Pro-Freedom values. The Left is the enemy of freedom. It is quite sad indeed that Ron Paul fails to see that. He is letting himself be used by the enemy – CBS, CNN, the Houston Chronicle, et.al.

I believe it’s time to declare Jeff Flake (or Dana Rohrabacher) as the new Champion of Freedom and the libertarian Republican movement.

And maybe it’s time that a real libertarian who supports the War on Islamo-Fascism run against Ron for the Congressional seat here in Texas.

So much for fighting “from within” the primary party that promoted the Patriot Act. Needless to say, I won’t be sending the RLC any checks this year — or the next.

posted by Stephen Gordon
  • http://www.LPWI.org Rolf Lindgren

    Another problem for Libertarians ‘fighting from within'; many people will be believe YOUR values are republican party values.

    There’s not.

    So the same people that hear your Libertarian message will often end up voting for many other anti-Libertarian republicans, both now, and in the future.

    Sue Jeffers in MN is a great example. How many libertarian-minded people in MN will get the impression that other republicans are libertarian friendly as well, and deserve our votes? How does that help the liberty movement?

  • Julian

    I too support the war anywhere anytime against the radical element of Islam. Because I do, I have been vilified and disrespected by other libertarians (LP members)for my position both on this site and at local meetings. As far as they are concerned, they are the only right answer to a very complex issue.

    The very same people support the notion that our troops should only be used if we are invaded but refuse to acknowledge that we are being invaded on our southern border by illegals that have no desire to be citizens. If my take on libertarianism is correct, then it is logical to post troops on our borders to prevent the “invasion”. Why is it that many libertarians call me a neocon because I differ with them but on the other hand they embrace many leftist beliefs yet lay claim to libertarianism.

    Why do they find it necessary to vilify libertarians that fall within the litmus test but tend to be more to the right on some issues? I cry foul. You are not being fair.

  • http://warcriminal.freeservers.com Sol

    Red sheep, blue sheep, they’re all sheep. There’s no point fighting from within a corrupt, immoral party that the flock always stays with.

  • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Urban_II Pope Urban II

    Julian,

    If you are a Libertarian, do you think the U.S. Congress should declare war before we go and attack Islam?

    My famous speech in 1095 in southern France started the 1st Crusade. No democratic congress was around to check my reckless actions.

    Because of me, the American Founding Fathers added a Constitutional provision that war must be declared by Congress.

  • http://libertarianyouth.blogspot.com Nigel Watt

    Wow, we’re getting Michael Brown, dead popes – Everybody’s coming to comment at HoT!

  • Stephen VanDyke

    Declared or not, I think our nations invaded to nations rebuilt ratio should be a little lower than 2-to-0 given we’ve been at this for almost five fucking years now.

    How come Afghanistan is still such a shithole throwback to the 16th-century? Perhaps G Dubs was on to something back in 2000 when he was against nation-building before he was for it.

  • http://www.renbook.com Gene Berkman

    The Republican Liberty Caucus is actually divided on the war, with the Chair and many others opposed to the Iraq War and the Patriot Act. Eric Dondero (or Rittberg) has not been involved with RLC for some time.

    However, RLC is neutralized by its Republican affiliation. Some Republican candidates are worth supporting – Ron Paul, Tom McClintock, etc – but RLC backs many candidates who voted for the war and the Patriot Act – including John Kyl in Arizona, George Allen in Virginia.

    I urge Libertarians to avoid supporting or working with the Republican Liberty Caucus. If you want to support a Republican candidate, do so as an independent or Libertarian.

    RLC was meaningful when Democrats controlled Congress. Since the GOP has gained power, RLC has failed to oppose the statist initiatives of the Republicans.

  • http://www.GetLiberty.org Aaron

    The RLC, to the contrary of Gene’s comment above, has indeed opposed the statist initiatives of the Republicans — and has given a voice to those in the GOP who are looking for alternatives but refuse to join a radical fringe “lots-of-talking-but-no-doing” entity such as the LP.

    From gay marriage bans to term limits to eminent domain, the RLC has been a consistent voice of opposition to the GOP establishment. Unlike the LP, the RLC has elected state legislators who really are working for less government and more freedom. These legislators include (among countless others) several members of Congress, one Governor (Sanford), over sixteen State Senators, and almost 40 State Representatives.

  • http://www.lputah.org/liberty Rob

    I recently wrote on my blog, while linking to the Republican Liberty Caucus:

    “I toiled for several years within the Republican Party to work for change. I now know that the Republican Party is where liberty goes to die.”

  • http://www.renbook.com Gene Berkman

    Aaron may be correct that members of the Republican Liberty Caucus oppose the statist initiatives of the Republicans, but they do so in a very private manner.

    Most of the Republicans elected to office that RLC has supported, have gone along with Republican statism, including the War on Iraq, the Patriot Act, the War on Drugs, banning Gay marriage, and banning abortion.

    A few real libertarians have been elected on the Republican ticket, but RLC has made only nominal contributions to their election. NORML has given as much money to Ron Paul’s campaigns as RLC has.

  • http://www.chuckmoulton.org/ Chuck Moulton

    If one kook in the Republican Liberty Caucus can make people curse the whole bunch of them, what hope does the Libertarian Party have? We are not kookless.

    By his language it is pretty clear that Eric Dondero is a hawk Republican… likely an objectivist. He’s not a libertarian. I know many members of the Republican Liberty Caucus who actually are libertarian.

  • http://knappster.blogspot.com Thomas L. Knapp

    Quoth Aaron:

    “From gay marriage bans to term limits to eminent domain, the RLC has been a consistent voice of opposition to the GOP establishment”

    Of the 9 US Senators on the Republican Liberty Caucus’s 2005 “Liberty Index” list of “top ten congressmen”, 8 voted last week in favor of cloture on a Constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage. The only “RLC top-tenner” who voted no was Judd Gregg of New Hampshire.

    The 10th congresscritter on the list is US Representative Jeff Flake, who was so strong on term limits that he promised from his first campaign on to serve no more than three terms — but turned out to be a liar.

    If the RLC is serious about being a “consistent voice of opposition,” it needs to stop promoting anti-libertarians like (in recent years) John McCain(!) and Rick Santorum(!!) as “libertarian Republicans.”

  • http://www.chrisbennettfromillinois.blogspot.com Chris Bennett

    Eric Dondero told me a few months ago on a yahoo list that pro-life libertarians like me should take a back seat on the bus. As an African-American whose grandparents fought to sit anywhere on the bus I did not take that comment really well. I think Eric is a warmonger, racist fascist that needs to be shot!

  • http://libertarianyouth.blogspot.com Nigel Watt

    He might not have known that you were black…

  • http://www.chrisbennettfromillinois.blogspot.com Chris Bennett

    Nigel:

    He knew and he’s the type of individual that tries to get a rise out of someone without knowing what consequences may happen.

  • Julian

    Chris Bennett

    You and I have some common ground. Because we do not agree with every single element of the LP doctrine or may I say with some libertarians, then we are ostracized and wrong.

    I absolutely do not agree with local libertarians I have debated that support NAMBLA and believe the age of consent should be abolished as an antiquated law. I debated several of them at a meeting recently. They are outright pedophiles, no doubt, and want to claim to be libertarians. They are perverts.

    Even the LP should have some standards and refuse to allow those types in. I think libertarians want to come off as being totally antiwar and socially radical to the extreme that any personal action is OK.

    Correct me if I am wrong. I believe you have a right to be pro-life and some of those assholes just need to learn to live with it.

  • Devious David

    Thank you, thank you, thank you. Even more overwhelming evidence that the GOP and liberty have absolutely no connection, however tenous, whatsoever.

    To hell with the GOP and RLC, etc etc etc. This is just further proof. The sick and sad thing is that so many of the “pro-liberty” organizations are really just fronts for the GOP. They would NEVER in a million years forsake their highly valuable GOP credentials to stand up for real, genuine liberty. None of those organizations deserve your money or time. Caveat emptor indeed. They are Republican sycophant to the bone. It is time to permanently sever any relationship between the GOP and liberty. If you are unwilling, than as far as I’m concerned, you are the enemy and actively working against the goal at hand.

    And by, the way. Now that Zarqawi is dead, I’m sure “we’ve turned a corner”. LOL. What a crock. To hell with ANYTHING even remotely Republican. It is designed to the core to absorb your time and money while derailing liberty.

  • disinter
  • Sandra Kallander

    One thing is obvious: we can always pick a fight with a whole group because we judge them by the actions of one or more of the members. We can always pick a fight with an indidvidual because of one of their actions among many and over time.

    If you’re looking to pick a fight or start a war, you can always find a reason.

    I’m a Libertarian because I want to relate to each person as an individual. I recently helped a Republican and a Democrat fight a free speech battle I was glad they were fighting. When I fought to reduce taxes, I had help from members of both groups, as well.

    I can’t write off a whole group of people because of a group they belong to, whether they’re Iraqi’s, Libertarians or space aliens. Even if I’m fighting that group, I need to know each member as an individual in order to win.

  • http://www.phillies2008.org George Phillies

    There is no such thing as ‘Islamofascism’. It’s a Republican hate word invented to justify George Bush’s war of aggression against Iraq. The technique is familiar from the techniques of history’s real fascists, who made up a variety of boogiemen to frighten voters into voting fascist. When you hear a Republican invoking the phrase you are likely to be listening to a genocide advocate who wants to use his country to destroy a religion he dislikes.

    Unsurprisingly, these people are also gay-bashers and antiabortion bigots.

    Now that I’ve discussed their bad side, I could continue with their worse side, e.g., George Bush being the biggest spendthrift wastrel President in the history of America, but I am short of space.

  • http://www.RLC.org Bill Westmiller

    > I won’t be sending the RLC any checks …

    That’s your decision, but it shouldn’t be based on the opinions of two people (or a dozen) who have no position within the RLC, much less speaking on its behalf.
    Most of the posters display an ignorance of what the RLC does or has done. Visit the site, read our Statement and press releases, review our Liberty Index, and candidates. Then decide whether we’re worth supporting.

  • Jim Allison

    The RLC is in pretty bad shape. Their PAC raises about $5000 every TWO years. They contribute very little to Ron Paul’s campaign percentage wise. Membership, after 15 years of existence, is about 1600.

    I haven’t been able to find any information on how many delegates the RLC sent to the last GOP convention, or how many RLC members serve in leadership positions within the GOP at the national, state, and local levels. Maybe Bill can give me those numbers?

    The idea of making one of the major parties libertarian is a great idea, but my experience with RLCers is that they too are all-talk and no-action, just like many LPers. It seems to be a trend among liberty minded folks.

    We can form all the organizations we want, call them cool names like “caucus”, but if we don’t raise money and get our hands dirty with work, we’ll continue to see government get bigger and bigger.

  • http://www.RLC.org Bill Westmiller

    Jim: The RLC is in pretty bad shape.

    That was true a few years ago and we still have a lot of work to do. Over the past two years, we’ve doubled our membership, added 12 new chartered states, and can claim a half-dozen RLC members in state legislatures.
    We don’t track GOP convention delegates, nor quiz our members on their official party positions.
    Like any political group, we have our talkers. But we’re attracting lots of new activists and viable candidates; we are sought out by major organizations for issue support; and we’ve had a warm response to solicitations.
    We’re making good progress.

  • Wendy Terry

    DD: “Now that Zarqawi is dead, I’m sure “we’ve turned a corner”. LOL. What a crock. To hell with ANYTHING even remotely Republican. It is designed to the core to absorb your time and money while derailing liberty.”

    LOL — exactly! In fact, the whole Zarqawi thing was nothing more than PsyOps. The very idea that Zarqawi was a leader in any bin Laden organization is absurd. A new “goldstein” has already emerged in his place. I wonder how many times they’ll kill this new one?

    Everything Republican or Democrat is part of the false left/right paradigm that is more PsyOps. They get the American Sheeple looking at the smoke surrounding gay marriage & the lies emanating from the TERROR WAR (woo ha ha — boogedy, boogedy) and never see reality of the truth and that stares them in the face.

    GOP reform is a LOST cause.

  • penny langford

    Quote from Nazi Herman Goering as told to Gustave Gilbert during the Nuremberg Trials:

    “Of course, the people don’t want war. But after all, it’s the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it’s always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it’s a democracy, a fascist dictoatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denouce the pacifists for lack of patriotism amd exposing the country to greater danger. It works the same way in any country.”

    Who cares what party or group you’re with. We, as Americans should always question our leaders. We are paying them!! Those who’ve bought the government propaganda have forgotten their history. They trust a government who has proven itself untrustworthy.