Sad That CD-22 GOP Won’t Endorse Smither

Libertarian/Republican candidate for the Vermont house in the Orleans-Caledonia 1 district, Ben Todd, had an excellent letter to the editor published on FortBendNow:

Dear Editor,

I am a Libertarian/Republican candidate for state house in Vermont. In Vermont Libertarians and Republicans have allied themselves to work on very important fiscal issues like repealing the statewide property tax etc. The Vermont Republican party has nominated and endorsed 5 Libertarian party candidates.

I find it sad that the Republican party in your area has chosen to let a Liberal Democrat get elected by not endorsing Libertarian Bob Smither for congress in cd-22. Bob Smither would well represent many Republicans in Texas, just as we are here in Vermont. I encourage all Republicans in CD-22 to ignore the destructive actions of the GOP and place their vote for Bob Smither. If not we may see a Democratic speaker of the house.

Check him out at: www.smither4congress.com

Thank You,

Benjamin Todd
Barton Vermont

Feel free to write your own letter, in support of Bob Smither, to FortBendNow via their form located on the right-hand side of the page.

posted Oct 16th, 2006 by disinter
  • http://gondwanaland.com/mlog/ Mike Linksvayer

    Since I’ve commented in the past that bettors weren’t giving Smither a snowball’s chance … I have to say that now they are. Last trade on TX22-other was at 15, corresponding to a 15% chance of victory. Last trade on TX22-gop was only 10!

    http://www.tradesports.com/pda/contracts.jsp?eventID=48397&groupID=4494&className=Politics

  • Devious David

    That page is hard to understand. What is the open interest for “other” candidates?

  • George Whitfield

    I added a comment under Ben Todd’s effective letter on the Fort Bend site. I encourage all Libertarians to go to http://www.smither4congress.com and donate now.

  • disinter

    George,

    Is yours #4? If so, brilliant!

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Benjamin, you’re a hero. Great letter.

    Good job buddy. And please win your race. The Movement for Liberty needs you in the Vermont Legislature!

  • undercover_anarchist

    Real libertarians support property tax and oppose income and sales taxes.

  • undercover_anarchist

    And I wouldn’t endorse a loser who only raised $1600 by June 30, either.

  • Leroy

    If Smither’s victory means that we’ll continue to have a Republican Speaker of the House, as opposed to a Democratic one if the election goes to his opponent, then I’d vote for the Democratic candidate (Lampson?)

    Republicans are the true enemies of freedom.

  • George Whitfield

    Well Mike, my comment hasn’t been published yet so I can’t accept the praise but I agree #4 was great. My comment is much more mundane and I have tried to post it again. To Undercover, I am quite confident that Bill Smither has raised at least 2.625 times that amount by now.

  • disinter

    And I wouldn’t endorse a loser who only raised $1600 by June 30, either.

    He has raised tens of thousands. Hell, my partner and I have given Smither more than $1,600.

  • Devious David

    Bill Smither? I thought it was Bob!

    Real Libertarians don’t support any taxation! And Bob Smither is no loser.

  • Devious David

    Leroy, the Speaker won’t really matter. The Democrats are no different. In fact, if the Democrats win majorities in the House and Senate, the next two years will damage their party because they won’t do anything different in Iraq for one. I have to wonder what their constituencies would think about that. They’d just spin their wheels on Iraq. In fact, one thing that might happen is that Bush dumps Iraq in his Democratic succesor’s lap and there is a Democratic majority in Congress. They would spin their wheels doing nothing (as planned) for years and the emperor would then have no clothes. The war would become a problem of the Democrats creation over time. This might ignite the Republicans to demand it’s end while retaining face.

    I think having a Democratic majority with Bob Smither in there and a Republican speaker could keep government divided. Having Pelosi as speaker in that case might actually embolden Democrats a little too much. We want whatever faux division we can get.

  • Leroy

    DD, I agree that the differences between both major parties is slim. However, I think a Democratic majority in the House will put a check on the most severe civil liberties abuses. They will be more willing to protect sensitive environmental areas from industrial exploitation (something I support but many of my fellow libertarians will disagree on). A strong majority of Democrats in the House now support protecting medical marijuana patients from the DEA in states where it’s legal. You may be right about Iraq, but the important thing is to end the one party rule, especially since that party is so hostile to freedom.

    It now looks as if the Democrats will win back the House – the Senate could very well be evenly split with that Dick giving the Republicans majority rule.

  • Devious David

    I agree that divided government is good. But the point I am trying to drive home is that the Democrats are just offering faux opposition. IE, they are out of power and look at how much they are willing to go along with the Republicans. They offer up “opposition” to differentiate themselves, but it couldn’t be any clearer that it’s not a fundamentally or hardly even superficially different track. It’s semantics and barely even that.

    Divided government will only result in partisan bickering, not policy arguments. I’ll be glad to get what bickering we can get, but don’t expect much of any substance at all in any case. It will be minimal and negligible.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    I suppose Leroy isn’t aware of Ron Paul, now a Congressman from Texas (neighboring District to Bob’s), former Libertarian Party Presidential candidate, current Libertarian Party member, AND A REPUBLICAN!

    Guess Leroy would like to see Ron Paul thrown out of Congress given the fact that he has an ‘R’ by his name and votes for his friend Denny Hastert for speaker.

    Funny Leroy brings up the medical marijuana issue, cause it’s REPUBLICANS who support it more the prohibitionist freedom-hating Democrats. Ron introduces a bill just about every year in Congress, like clockwork to legalize pot for medical use. Who sides with him? REPUBLICAN Congressman Dana Rohrabacher and Brian Bilbray of CA.

    Who supports stringent Drug Laws? Democrat Congressman Charlie Rangle of NY.

    Oh, and then there’s the Draft. Ditto on that one too. Ron on a yearly basis introduces a bill to abolish the Selective Service. Republicans support his bill, Rangle opposes it.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    I suppose Tax Cuts is not part of Leroy’s agenda. If it was, he would know that Rangle and Pelosi have both pledged that the VERY FIRST ITEM ON THEIR AGENDA, is to repeal the Bush Tax Cuts, once they take control of Congress.

    Wake up call for Leroy. Libertarianism is just about legalizing pot. Economic issue matter too. If you support tax increases and Congress critters who want more taxes, it’s damn near impossible to call oneself a “libertarian.”

    Try the label Socialist or Economic Fascist. You might find it’s a better fit.

  • Stuart Richards

    Any libetarian who can’t get behind Smither at this point is way too in love with the taste of sour grapes.

    You’re making up reasons to hate him when this is the most credible campaign we’ve probably ever run. If Smither isn’t good enough for you kids, nobody ever will be.

  • undercover_anarchist

    No way. He’s not even remotely the most credible candidate. He’s the luckiest, that’s it. And I don’t want a Republican speaker. I would like to see a libertarian in Congress. But not at the expense of freedom.

  • undercover_anarchist

    I think real libertarians don’t oppose taxes so much as they oppose the fact that government DOES something with the tax money. Not WHAT they do, but that they do it at all. Fed notes are created from thin air, anyway. If the government seized a share and then lit them on fire, what would be the real affect? Nothing. It’s the fact that they DO something with the tax dollars that matters. That is the real infringement on liberty. Particularly, the domestic spying and imperialist war mongering that you favor, Dondadda.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Ron Paul is an anti-capitalist, anti-immigrant, theocratic Ovarian Marxist. He doesn’t represent me in congress anymore than Ms. Pelosi does.

  • disinter

    Any libetarian who can’t get behind Smither at this point is way too in love with the taste of sour grapes.

    You’re making up reasons to hate him when this is the most credible campaign we’ve probably ever run. If Smither isn’t good enough for you kids, nobody ever will be.

    Stuart’s right. I would like to see you nay-sayers run for office and show all these horrible people how it’s done since you are the perfect libertarians and all.

  • undercover_anarchist

    That’s BS, Mike. That’s like saying I can’t criticize Shaq for not hitting his free throws because I can’t do any better.

    Smither might as well be a Republican. He will vote for a Republican speaker who will roll back freedom as much as possible. The LP needs to get out if its death-pact with the GOP. And let’s not rewrite history – Smither was a PAPER CANDIDATE who happened to get lucky with the DeLay scandle. He is not “the most credible” candidate (although I do now notice that Stuart said “credible campaign,” not “credible candidate”).

  • disinter

    UA – yea yea… bitch and moan.. cry some tears… boo hoo.

    No one cares that these candidates are not 100% like you.

    Let us know when you grow some balls and run for office. Show us all how it’s done since you are the perfect libertarian!

  • Stuart Richards

    I think real libertarians don’t oppose taxes so much as they oppose the fact that government DOES something with the tax money.

    I think real libertarians don’t make blanket statements regarding their own personal philosophy and then try to say the whole movement agrees with them?

    I mean, that’s cool and all that you think that, but I don’t want you telling me what I think anymore than I want Eric Dondero doing so.

  • Leroy

    Funny Leroy brings up the medical marijuana issue, cause it’s REPUBLICANS who support it more the prohibitionist freedom-hating Democrats

    Dondero, this is completely false. Check out HR5672 from 6/28/06 (the bill to protect medical marijuana patients):
    Republicans voted AGAINST it 206-18 (6 no votes).
    Democrats voted FOR it 144 to 53 (4 no votes).

    Yes, there are some good Republicans such as Ron Paul. But he is far, far outside the mainstream of Republican thought.

    I suggest you take a look at this HoT article. You will see the majority of Republicans are AUTHORITARIANS:
    http://hammeroftruth.com/2006/03/13/senate-democrats-more-libertarian-than-their-gop-counterparts

    The Republicans favor less freedom even on economic issues.

    I’m not saying I like the Democrats, they’re just the less evil of the two. I still vote Libertarian.

    Dondero, I suggest you drop the idea that you care about freedom – you’re just an apologist for Republican fascism.

  • ZanderC

    undercover_anarchist: If you find all of our candidates so displeasing, please shut up, run for office yourself, and show us how it’s done.

    Thanks.

  • Leroy

    The link I gave listed Senators on the Nolan Chart. This link shows House members on the Nolan Chart:

    http://hammeroftruth.com/2006/02/03/congress-not-representative-of-america/

    You’ll see Ron Paul at the top, but most Republicans are in the authoritarian quadrant.

    Dondero, you like taking the rare Republican who supports freedom and then extrapolating this to infer that most Republicans care about it. This is consistent with the rest of your reasoning abilities. No surprise that the RLC is completely ineffective.

  • http://www.ilovephysics.com Chris Moore

    Wait. I’m shocked. Eric Dondero assured me that Dana Rohrabacher was a leader in the libertarian movement, and a true libertarian. He only receives a 43% — 27% social and 60% economic. And the other “great libertarian Congressman”, Jeff Flake, is wrong on social issues 60% of the time.

    I’m so confused. Dondero keeps telling me these guys are mainstream libertarians. Is he wrong? ;)

  • Andy

    “Real libertarians support property tax and oppose income and sales taxes.

    Comment by undercover_anarchist”

    Funny, I thought that REAL libertarians were not in support of any taxes.

  • Andy

    “Ron Paul is an anti-capitalist, anti-immigrant, theocratic Ovarian Marxist.”

    That is a completely absurd statement.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Sorry I’m dealing with reality once again. I know its inconvenient for some of you. Smither was a paper candidate. Give up your revisionist history. I don’t want a Republican speaker. I don’t want a “libertarian” candidate who is completely unfaithful to the LP platform, pre-convention 06. Is that so much to ask for? I’ve given well over $1000 to LP (and non-LP) candidates this election cycle. I have run for office (not as an LP candidate) before, but I’m concentrating on my professional life now. I can criticize and lament all that I want – you “libertarians” expect blind obedience and mass hallucination over inferior candidates running inferior campaigns on $500.

    If you want to ban me from this blog, then do so. Otherwise, I will continue to be critical. Sorry that all you want to hear is rose-collored bullshit.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Andy- What parts of what I said about Mr. Paul are untrue?

    From wikipedia:

    “In 2006 he introduced H.R. 776 to have Congress declare that life exists at conception”

    “He voted against the Federal Marriage Amendment in 2004.”

    “In 1999 he voted for H.R. 2587 that banned gay couples from adopting children in the District of Columbia.”

    He was “the only dissenting vote against giving Rosa Parks the Congressional Gold Medal of Honor.”

    “Many of his writings are published by the John Birch Society.”

    “He voted against the Central American Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA).”

    He supports “tort reform.”

    He “has supported border security and opposed illegal immigration.”

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    Bill Smither? I thought it was Bob!

    It’s Mr. Smither.

    Real Libertarians don’t support any taxation!

    Hear, hear.

    If Smither’s victory means that we’ll continue to have a Republican Speaker of the House, as opposed to a Democratic one if the election goes to his opponent, then I’d vote for the Democratic candidate (Lampson?)

    Republicans are the true enemies of freedom.

    Leroy hits the nail on the head!

    http://antiwar.com/justin?articleid=9869

    No way. He’s not even remotely the most credible candidate. He’s the luckiest, that’s it. And I don’t want a Republican speaker. I would like to see a libertarian in Congress. But not at the expense of freedom.

    I agree.

    I’m so confused. Dondero keeps telling me these guys are mainstream libertarians. Is he wrong?

    Do any bears shit in the woods?

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    If you find all of our candidates so displeasing, please shut up, run for office yourself, and show us how it’s done.

    Red herring. UA has complimented some LP candidates. Doesn’t mean he has to like all of them.

    Same goes for me.

    BTW before you ask, you probably wouldn’t want me to run. I’m way to extreme (proud to be an anarchist), I don’t file with the IRS, I don’t have a state drivers license, and I wouldn’t tone down my views for a political race. Also, I travel for a living, have both felony and misdemeanor convictions and have been in jail in seven states (although never in prison).

    I’ll still claim my right to shoot off at the mouth, or fingertips as the case may be here.

    Hey, I just thought of an idea!

    Would any of you big spenders send me some money so that I do NOT run for office? That would be cool.

    Thanks in advance!

  • Devious David

    UA, I have to wonder what the reason for your confused variety of hyper-leftism is.

    I’d like to see you go to a libertarian event and tell Ron Paul to his face what you think. He’d probably be too much of a gentleman to slap you across the face. He does more, far more for the cause of liberty in a week than you have done in your lifetime. Do you have any idea what it must be like to stand up there and make unpopular votes all by yourself? It seems to me that many of your selected quotes from wikipedia corroborate my position.

  • Andy

    “In 2006 he introduced H.R. 776 to have Congress declare that life exists at conception”

    So what? I don’t consider abortion to be a definitional libertarian issue. One can make a legitimate arguement that abortion is murder.

    “He voted against the Federal Marriage Amendment in 2004.”

    Marriage is not a federal issue.

    “In 1999 he voted for H.R. 2587 that banned gay couples from adopting children in the District of Columbia.”

    I realize that this is a controversial and debated topic. Considering that gays can’t have kids on their own and considering the percentage of gay pedophiles I can see why he voted against this.

    “He was “the only dissenting vote against giving Rosa Parks the Congressional Gold Medal of Honor.”

    So what? Is it the job of Congress to give out medals?

    “Many of his writings are published by the John Birch Society.”

    The John Birch Society puts out a lot of good stuff. Yeah, I know they lean conservative but I’ve got no problem with

  • Andy

    working with “conservatives” or “liberals” when their issues coincide with liberty.

    He supports “tort reform.”

    So what?

    “He ‘has supported border security and opposed illegal immigration.’”

    Another controversial and debated topic within libertarian circles. The true libertarian poistion is that all land should be controlled by individuals and that every individual should be able to create their own immigration policies. However, this is not the world in which we live. Most land is under government control and we have a welfare state. Ron Paul is not opposed to all immigration, but he is opposed to global government and the expansion of the welfare state.

    I’ve got a lot of respect for Ron Paul. He’s the most honest person in Congress.

  • Andy

    “UA, I have to wonder what the reason for your confused variety of hyper-leftism is.”

    undercover_anarchist comes off as a confused individual.

    “I’d like to see you go to a libertarian event and tell Ron Paul to his face what you think. He’d probably be too much of a gentleman to slap you across the face. He does more, far more for the cause of liberty in a week than you have done in your lifetime. Do you have any idea what it must be like to stand up there and make unpopular votes all by yourself?”

    Agreed. Ron Paul is a hero in the struggle for liberty.

  • Andy

    “Smither was a paper candidate. Give up your revisionist history. I don’t want a Republican speaker. I don’t want a “libertarian” candidate who is completely unfaithful to the LP platform, pre-convention 06.”

    I agree with undercover_anarchist here. Smithers strikes me as a guy who just happened to be in the right place at the right time rather than being “the best Libertarian candidate for Congress ever.” If DeLay wasn’t out of that race we probably wouldn’t even know who Smithers was. Also, I’m skeptical of any “Libertarian” candidate who supports the “Fair Tax” scam.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    For a true measure of who is and who is not a libertarian in Congress go to http://www.rlc.org and click on Liberty Index.

    The author is Clifford Thies, Ph.D. Durrell Chair of Economics at Shenandoah Univ. He is also one of the original members of both the Libertarian Party and Republican Liberty Caucus. He also served as RLC National Chairman and Treasurer of the Libertarian Party for many years.

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    The RLC’s “Liberty Index” is way, way, waaaayyy off the mark in measuring liberty.

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    http://hammeroftruth.com/2006/03/13/senate-democrats-more-libertarian-than-their-gop-counterparts

    http://hammeroftruth.com/2006/02/03/congress-not-representative-of-america/

    Good luck getting Eric to provide a straight answer to this.

    Of course the REPUBLICAN “liberty caucus” will come up with a distorted measure which self-servingly “proves” that Republicans are more libertarian.

    They aren’t, and never were.

    http://mises.org/story/2099

  • TerryP

    UA, I am still trying to figure out why you believe just because Smither would vote for a republican leader, why that means he will vote with the republicans 100% of the time. No matter who is the majority leader they still need at least 50% of the votes to get legislation through. Even if Smither gives them the majority on every vote they will need 100% loyalty from the republicans and Smither or some defections from the Democrat party to get legislation through. My guess is Smither will vote libertarian on most issues which means he will vote with the republicans on some things and against them on many others, especially the ones dealing with civil rights issues.

  • Andy

    “He voted against the Central American Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA).”

    Ron Paul on CAFTA and Dietary Supplements
    http://www.house.gov/paul/tst/tst2005/tst071805.htm

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    I am still trying to figure out why you believe just because Smither would vote for a republican leader, why that means he will vote with the republicans 100% of the time. No matter who is the majority leader they still need at least 50% of the votes to get legislation through.

    Leadership appoints who heads the committees, which can initiate investigations and, perhaps, an impeachment.

  • Andy
  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    CAFTA and similar agreements are not real free trade.

    They are globally managed trade.

    Real free trade doesn’t require booklength agreements or bureaucratic managers such as the WTO, you just do it.

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    The Federal Marriage Amendment (FMA) is a proposed amendment to the United States Constitution which would define marriage in the United States as a union of one man and one woman.

    I’m quite surprised U_A would hold Ron Paul’s vote against THAT to be a bad thing.

  • disinter

    I don’t want a Republican speaker. I don’t want a “libertarian” candidate who is completely unfaithful to the LP platform, pre-convention 06. Is that so much to ask for?

    Then don’t vote for him! Is that too much to ask for?

    Do you even live in his district?

    Quit crying. If you think you are so much better, run your own campaign. Show these stupid guys how to do it.

  • disinter

    I’m quite surprised U_A would hold Ron Paul’s vote against THAT to be a bad thing.

    I’m not.

  • Andy

    “CAFTA and similar agreements are not real free trade.

    They are globally managed trade.

    Real free trade doesn’t require booklength agreements or bureaucratic managers such as the WTO, you just do it.”

    Exactly. Here’s a good article on this subject from The New American Magazine which is affiliated with the John Birch Society. This article hits the nail on the head.

    The Phony ‘Free Trade’ Lobby
    http://www.thenewamerican.com/artman/publish/article_1362.shtml

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    I’m not.

    U_A has been pro gay rights, so perhaps when he read that RP opposes gay adoption and that he also opposes the marriage amendment, he may have thought that the marriage amendment was pro gay marriage rights?

  • ZanderC

    U_A: There’s nothing “revisionist” about my impression of Smither. Apparently, he believes it to be a good strategy, FOR THE PURPOSES OF GETTING ELECTED, to maintain that he’ll caucus with the Republicans. You think, living in TX CD-22, he’s going to get elected if he tells the people there, THE PEOPLE WHO REPEATEDLY ELECTED TOM DELAY, that he’ll vote for Nancy Pelosi for Speaker that he’ll win? What kind of koolaid are you drinking?

    Who are you to criticize him for what he believes to be the optimum strategy for WINNING? He *was* a paper candidate who is now our leading candidate. Please explain the revisionism I engaged in. Your feet aren’t beating the pavement for voters anywhere. You just come here and complain, that not everyone is a 100/100 Libertarian, like so many other “do-nothing/armchair” Libertarians I know.

  • George Whitfield

    Although I don’t agree with him on every issue, I am still glad to support Mr. Bob Smither and wish him the best. I agree with him on far more than I do with his opponents. He is lucky but he is hard working. Luck is another word for opportunity. And the harder we work the luckier we will get. Lets take advantage of this opportunity. Check out his website and send him a contribution: http://www.smither4congress.com

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    Proof that a strong antiwar position can stand up in conservative Texas, from Wikipedia:

    Congressman Paul advocates a strict non-interventionist foreign policy. He voted against the Iraq War Resolution and continues to criticize the US presence in Iraq and what he charges is the use of the war on terror to curtail civil liberties. He has also broken with his party by voting against the Patriot Act in 2001 and again in 2005, and is very opposed to a military draft. He strongly endorses American withdrawal from the United Nations.

    His base of support has been among conservative Republicans, but after 9/11 he has gained some strong support from liberal Democrats in central Texas because of his consistent opposition to the war in Iraq. As an example of this shift, the Austin Chronicle newspaper, a liberal, alternative weekly newspaper in Austin, Texas described his views as erratic in 2000.

  • http://c4ss.org/ paulie cannoli

    (…55…)

    After 9/11 though, the Chronicle took a much more favorable view of Paul, praising him for his strong principled opposition to the Iraq War.

    In a recent speech before the House of Representatives, Paul expressed his concern about the possibility of an Iran War. He claimed that the circumstances under which it would occur would be similar to those under which the Iraq War began, and urged Congress not to begin a war with Iran.

  • Andy

    “Your feet aren’t beating the pavement for voters anywhere. You just come here and complain, that not everyone is a 100/100 Libertarian, like so many other “do-nothing/armchair” Libertarians I know.”

    From some of the posts that I’ve read from undercover_anarchist lately it sounds like he’s not a 100/100 libertarian himself.

  • Lex

    Bob Smither isn’t the best Libertarian congressional candidate ever (or even in Texas, this year), but he is in the right place at the right time, has a good history of community involvement, and looks like a serious candidate. His support for the un-Fair Tax is sad, but might help him gain Republican votes.

  • Lex

    “Real libertarians support property tax and oppose income and sales taxes.”

    Real libertarians realize that all taxes are merely institutionalized theft.

  • http://freelancify.com Nigel Watt

    UA: Ron Paul votes against every medal of honor, because he thinks it’s a bad use of taxpayer money. He voted against one for Tony Blair, etc. The fac that he voted against Rosa Parks’s medal is a show of principle, not of racism.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    No, the anti-War position does not stand up in Texas. Texans are hardcore anti-Islamo-Fascist. And Ron Paul realizes that. I live in his District, and his mailings to constituents are laden with Pro-Military, Support the Troops, Veterans Rights, Red, White and Blue slogans.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Paulie, is obviously unaware of the infamous “Ron Paul exception” on The Hill within the GOP Caucus. In 1997, with the new arriving “freshmen class” Gingrich had a welcoming meeting. He strongarmed the freshmen to “vote the Party line”. Then he paused and said, “Well, except for my old friend Ron Paul, of course. He gets a pass.”

    It’s been that way ever since. The GOP leadership gives Ron a pass for his libertarian views, so long as he’s a team player on voting for leadership.

    It’s a comfortable alliance that works for both sides.

    I would strongly suspect Bob Smither if elected would be treated in the exact same manner as RP.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Let’s not forget, that there is precedent for elected Libertarians “Caucusing” with the Republican Party.

    Many of you Newbies were not around in 1985/86. Libertarian Andre Marrou served as a single-term State Legislator representing Homer in the Alaska House. Reason Magazine did a big write-up on “Alaska’s lone Libertarian Legislator” in 1986. In the article, Marrou described how he officially “Caucused” with the GOP, even though he was a registered Libertarian.

    The same will happen I’m sure with the “Vermont Libertarian 5″ currently running for State House under the GOP banner.

    Libertarians keep their separate identity, yet assist the GOP team from time to time. What’s wrong with that?

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Why take Clifford Thies’s word for it? He’s only a Ph.D. greatly respected Economics Professor at a distinguished Virginia University.

    But alas, if one doubts the veracity of the RLC’s Liberty Index, one only need to ask Ron Paul himself.

    I’m sure most here would agree – save UA – that Ron Paul is a hero for libertarian values in the US Congress and votes libertarian perhaps 99% of the time.

    Surprise, surprise. Ron Paul, when he’s been asked COUNTLESS TIMES over the years, “Congressman, is there another Congressman who matches your views?” He responds unflinchingly:

    “Jeff Flake of Arizona. Jeff and I are together 99 out of 100 times on votes.”

    Second surprise, surprise. Flake has been the winner of the Liberty Index 3 years in a row, even beating his good friend Ron Paul this year by 8 (!!!) points!!

  • http://www.ilovephysics.com Chris Moore

    “Jeff Flake of Arizona. Jeff and I are together 99 out of 100 times on votes.”

    That’s funny, Eric. Because when I look at each man’s voting record, I see something completely different. Although on votes concerning finance and economic issues they are 99-100% on the same page, Jeff Flake is out of step with Ron Paul on social issue votes about 40% of the time.

    Jeff Flake is a fiscally conservative, socially conservative Republican. He could be worse, and there are several hundred congressmen who are worse, but in my opinion he is no libertarian.

    “He’s only a Ph.D. greatly respected Economics Professor at a distinguished Virginia University.”

    Larry Sabato is a respected professor at a distinguished Virginia University. His political opinion carries little weight with me as well. George Phillies is a Ph.D. greatly respected Physics Professor at a distinguished Massachusetts University, but you’ve repeatedly called him a loser.

  • Zander C

    “Second surprise, surprise. Flake has been the winner of the Liberty Index 3 years in a row, even beating his good friend Ron Paul this year by 8 (!!!) points!!”

    Dondero: Please provide a link to a page which articulates how the “Liberty Index” is calculated. The index may be no more indicative of Liberty than Jerry Falwell’s Liberty University.

  • Andy

    When I was in Texas I met a lot of people who were anti-war.

  • paulie cannoli

    Libertarians keep their separate identity, yet assist the GOP team from time to time. What’s wrong with that?

    Wrong major party, especially at this historical juncture.

    http://mises.org/story/2099

    http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=9869

    Why take Clifford Thies’s word for it? He’s only a Ph.D. greatly respected Economics Professor at a distinguished Virginia University.

    Robert Reich is an economics professor too. So what?

    “Jeff Flake of Arizona. Jeff and I are together 99 out of 100 times on votes.”

    Source of quote? As Chris pointed out, it’s factually inaccurate, even if Ron Paul did say it, but I won’t even believe he said it until you show me where you got that quote.

    his mailings to constituents are laden with Pro-Military, Support the Troops, Veterans Rights, Red, White and Blue slogans.

    I support the troops too, just not the mission, and I’m all for veterans rights. RP is clearly antiwar, and gets re-elected nevertheless.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Clearly, I mistook Ron Paul’s vote on the FMA. He has voted in an anti-gay manner on various other issues.

    Mike Nelson takes advantage of my typo to try to label me as an anti-gay bigot. Why don’t you go harass Allen Hacker some more. I’m not interested in being your whipping boy. You have issues, my friend. I’m more pro-gay than you are if you condone Ron Paul’s hyper-homphobia just because he’s an elected thug of the state.

  • disinter

    Mike Nelson takes advantage of my typo to try to label me as an anti-gay bigot.

    Oh, I guess I should assume everything you type is a “typo” then?

    I’m not interested in being your whipping boy.

    Too late.

    I’m more pro-gay than you are if you condone Ron Paul’s hyper-homphobia just because he’s an elected thug of the state.

    Are we reversing our “typo” claim now?

  • undercover_anarchist

    I pasted the damning evidence from Wikipedia. Amid a littany of anti-gay votes, Ron Paul voted correctly on the FMA. I accidentily pasted that. And then you say that you aren’t surprised that I would supposedly be in favor of the FMA, when I have a record of posting consistently pro-GLBT, anti-bigotry comments??? You may claim to not know my “record,” but even amid that post there was evidence of my pro-GLBT stance.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Mike Nelson is a digingenuous individual. I predict his days at HoT are numbered.

  • disinter

    UA – Did you use your tarrot cards for that one? Or do you have a crystal ball?

  • undercover_anarchist

    No. But I wouldn’t want to say that only “retards” believe in such things, because I would probably offend the overly sensitive nutwing of the LP.

  • disinter

    No. But I wouldn’t want to say that only “retards” believe in such things, because I would probably offend the overly sensitive nutwing of the LP.

    They would have to care what you thought first.

  • Andy

    “I pasted the damning evidence from Wikipedia.”

    Your “damning evidence” was very weak.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Two GOP sites now have endorsed Smither:

    http://www.gopprogress.com

    http://www.redstate.com

    Libertarians, please take a moment to go over there and post a note thanking them.

  • undercover_anarchist

    I know at least one “retard” who seems to care A LOT. He’s supposedly a reputable blogger, but he cyber-stalks my every post in a very unprofessional manner. I’m not naming any names.