Crucifying smokers on a cross of stupid

The latest in Omaha’s long string of blathering idiocies has just been passed. Mayor Mike Fahey, after flopping a steamer on city rights, has decided that 911 responders just aren’t busy enough.

From WorldNetDaily:

Omaha’s tough new anti-smoking ordinance banning the practice in nearly all public places comes with an even tougher enforcement policy.

The Nebraska city’s elected leaders and police department are urging residents who see violations to call the 9-1-1 emergency system for an immediate response.

Omaha banned smoking in public Oct. 2. Penalties are $100 for the first offense, $200 for the second and $500 for the third and subsequent infractions.

Teresa Negron, sergeant in charge of public information for the police, explained the department encourages observers of infractions to pick up the phone to report the infraction ““ just like they would for any other crime they observe being committed.

I’m a Nebraskan and as a Nebraskan, I can attest that Omaha is pretty much the worst-run city in America. It was founded over a century ago by crooks, swindlers and cheats and it’s still run by the same. The Democrats are bad and the Republicans are worse; even the foaming-at-the-mouth neocon screwballs would flog Nebraska’s GOP for their idiotarian big government tendencies. The Libertarians? They’re still out of commission, last I heard.

So yeah. You can’t smoke in Omaha or Captain Fahey the Wonder Moron’s emergency responders-cum-unwilling Gestapo will fine you. Reason #5872 for any sane Nebraskan to GTFO of Dodge (Street).

This wouldn’t worry me as much except that at this rate, Wonder Moron will have probably not only annexed Elkhorn, but taken over Lincoln, Grand Island, Kearney, all the way out to the Panhandle (that’s me!). Well honestly, he wouldn’t stop there-he’d probably declare all of Interstate 80 to be the latest extension of Dodge Street and be looking for some way to legally annex the entire state of South Dakota, eminent domain the hell out of the place and turn it into a lake/entertainment complex because a city government cannot actually masturbate.

In case you haven’t been able to pick up on my subtle hints, I really h8 Fahey kthx.

posted by Stuart Richards
  • http://somewhat-hypothesis.com colson

    As someone who lives in Omaha, I can’t really disagree with you at all. Fahey is an idiot but he wasn’t the one pushing the smoking ban – thank the Omaha city council for that. Mark Kraft, started the whole deal and Fahey said he would only pass it if it banned smoking everywhere. The city council, after discussing the issue with public health officials, finally passed the resolution and Fahey signed it. But there are a couple kickers:

    -Public health officials that were consulted were from UNMC, who coincidently support MOTAC – Metro Omaha Tobacco Action Committee, an anti-smoking group that has blatantly lied in the past and continues to lie to this day about the effects of second hand smoke.

    -Even more hilarity ensues when the passed version of the smoking ban actually exempts bars and Keno casinos: state sanctioned gambling. In other words, they knew the expected impact on state gambling revenues and protected their own asses.

  • DAP

    I too live in Omaha and it sucks. For a state so strongly republican, its crazy that it has some of the highest taxes in the country. To reiterate: Omaha sucks, don’t ever move here.

  • http://wesbenedictforlnc.blogspot.com/ Wes Benedict

    A Texas legislator reports the legislature will be considering a state-wide indoor smoking ban next legislative season. TX State LP committee willing, I plan to make this a recruiting opportunity for the Texas LP. Smokers are easy to find: in some bars, or, city bans in place, outside of bars and buildings on the sidewalk.

    However, there is a Libertarian Party Reform Caucus member on my state committe who thinks the Libertarian Party should support smoking bans because many voter do and that will help us look more main stream. I expect wiser minds and harder workers to defeat this Libertarian Party Reform Caucus non-sense, use the issue to build the Libertarian Party in Texas, and, polls willing, defeat this state-wide ban in Texas.

    However, if you’d like to support a smoking ban in Texas, join the Libertarian Party Reform Caucus or whatever it’s called.

  • Stuart Richards

    Nebraska has something like the fourth-highest tax burden in the nation. In the NATION. Only places like New York, Massachusetts and California are worse than us, and they have the excuse of being havens of socialism.

    Nebraska? We got a hardon for statism about 150 years ago and it’s still raging. :\

  • Stuart Richards

    Oh yeah, and Wes, this LRC supporter completely disagrees with smoking bans… as, I’d imagine, most of us do.

    There are ways to paint ourselves in a more popular light without actually going against principle. We can slow down our approach of principle. We can probably afford to give on a few minor issues in exchange for concessions on major ones.

    But supporting a smoking ban? Fuck that noise. There’s enough people whose brains weren’t a prize in a Cracker Jack box out there that we can stand on this particular principle and get ardent, broad-based support.

  • http://wesbenedictforlnc.blogspot.com/ Wes Benedict

    Stuart,

    You are probably right. There are ways for libertarian reform-minded folks to effectively promote smaller government without going against principle too much.

    The person I’m referring to claims to be a former salesman. I think he’s forgotten the role of the salesman.

    Salesman for Ford don’t say “I’m against bad quality Fords.” No, they hype the new Mustang (or whatever).

    Reform-minded Libertarians shouldn’t say “I’m not for anarchy,” or “I’m not for making heroin available to children.”

    Yet, when it comes to promoting the Libertarian Party in a positive light, so often it’s the so-called “moderates” or “reformists” who put the most radical foot forward and then claim “it ain’t mine!”

    My anecdotal experience has been that it’s the hyper-paranoid self-proclaimed reformists who unwittingly put forward the most radical libertarian viewpoints available with their pro-active negative disclaimers.

    Reformer to the press: “I am not crazy!”

    Bone heads.

  • DAP

    Awesome comment, Wes.

  • http://wesbenedictforlnc.blogspot.com/ Wes Benedict

    Reformer: We don’t hate government.

    Purist: We want to minimize government.

    Ref: We care about children too.

    Pur: Our children will thrive with less government.

    Ref: We have a plan to slowly, carefully, and responsibily reduce our troops in Iraq and put them nearby just in case before too long.

    Pur: We should leave Iraq immediately.

    Ref: We’re not against all taxation, just for fair taxation.

    Pur: Eliminate the income tax.

    Ref: It’s not like we promote sex with farm animals.

    Pur: Government should stay out of marriage.

    Ref: We are a nation of laws and must enforce them, especially with all the Mexicans because that’s a hot issue. We’re not sure about supporting our nation of drug laws, though. Hmmm.

    Pur: We are a nation of immigrants. Blaming Mexican or any immigrants for any economic issue in America is based on ignorance of free market dynamics.

    Ref: Like Nader says, corporations are inherently evil.

    Pur: Corporate rights are pre-knowable.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Do you think maybe they overreached? I mean, I’m starting to hear jokes about Omaha and this smoking ban. Surely, the Chamber of Commerce is going to wise up to that? When they start losing Convention revenue then they will quickly overturn it.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    Stuart, I’ll be petitioning shortly to overturn another smoking ban, in a major US city. It will be a local referendum.

    I’d be glad to help you all out for Omaha.

    Local referendum is the way to go on this.

  • disinter

    However, if you’d like to support a smoking ban in Texas, join the Libertarian Party Reform Caucus or whatever it’s called.

    LOL!

  • TerryP

    I also live in Nebraska and a “TABOR” like bill is on the ballot. The people against it (ie gov’t funded agancies, schools, etc.) have far more money then the people for it. All you hear is flat out lies from them about it. They are sent out to Rotarys, kiwanis, on TV, etc to tell people that their property taxes will go up, education and law enforcement will be cut drastically. They never tell you that if spending keeps increasing at the rate it has been that taxes will also have to go up at an even higher clip than if our “TABOR” is passed. They don’t tell you that all of organizations or people in them that are against the bill get their funding from the gov’t (ie taxpayer). They blame TABOR in Colorado for all of its problems even though spending increased by 88% (16th most) from ’91-’02 while TABOR was in effect. They think that because they suspened it for five years that it shows that it was bad. Actually that was what was supposed to happen. (con’t)

  • TerryP

    The people finally had a voice in the matter and were able to vote, instead of just letting the legislature and lobbyists increase their taxes at will. It was actually suspended because of two problems that we don’t have in Nebraska. First the ratchet down effect of their TABOR which I believe is corrected in the Nebraska bill and an education bill passed in 2002 that calls for mandatory increases in education spending above what the normal limits are in TABOR, thus putting a crunch on everything else. They fret about salaries for teachers being very low in Colarado but they never talk about kids scores or the quality of education only about teachers salaries. They blather on about how all spending will be decreased even though the bill allows for inflation plus population growth. Maybe they never learned the difference between increase and decrease. They expect their spending to increase faster than our wages and for us to like it. Give me a break!

  • http://www.reformthelp.org Carl

    Wes: there is an LP member who is blue. That doesn’t mean the entire LP supports overdosing on colloidal silver.

    I know of no article or platform proposal on the LRC site that supports indoor smoking bans.

    Fighting against such bans is exactly the sort of thing the LRC believes that the LP should be doing. This easily passes the 80th percentile test (at least 20% of the electorate are more radical than this position).

  • Michael H. Wilson

    There is a lesson in this that is being overlooked. Some 30 years ago a group got together to ban smoking on airplanes and they managed to get that done. Next they moved on to airports and then to another arena.
    Slowly they have eliminated smoking from many places.
    While I disagree with some of what they have targeted, I have to admire their zeal and work ethic.
    Change is actually possible thru hard work and staying on target.
    M.H.W.

  • http://www.mainstreamlibertarian.com Eric Dondero

    TerryP, the same exact thing is happening in Montana with TABOR. Though, the liberals have managed to get the initiative pretty much thrown off the ballot.

    The liberals blocked us libertarian petitioners all over MT, sometimes severely, surrounding us with their Union thugs, and keeping people from signing our petitions.

    Happily, I hear rumors that ALG and Paul Jacob will be cranking up again for 2008, and won’t let the liberals defeat us!!!

  • paulie cannoli

    The Libertarians? They’re still out of commission, last I heard.

    Dan Wilkinson told me that was just a temporary problem while he was going through a divorce. He reassures me that he is now answering all email to the state party.

    He said that he removed phone contact info because they were getting too many weird calls. I suggested voicemail or an answering machine.

    BTW it looks like the furthest west I can get a ride is Kearney.

    Stuart, I’ll be petitioning shortly to overturn another smoking ban, in a major US city. It will be a local referendum.

    I’d be glad to help you all out for Omaha.

    Local referendum is the way to go on this.

    You’ll have a tough time, since the smoking ban just passed by initiative this year.

  • paulie cannoli

    The blockers were annoying, but it was still workable.

  • http://www.lpnm.org Joseph Knight

    Smoking is healthier than fascism

    http://mail.libertarian-party-nm.org/pipermail/lpnm-forum_libertarian-party-nm.org/2006q3/000366.html

    We changed 2 out of 5 minds, the mayor and one councilor, just one short, so we lost in Farmington – but won a BUNCH of new friends and a few new members.

    Soon we will get to fight the same fight at the county and remaining 2 municipalities in the county.

  • paulie cannoli

    Happily, I hear rumors that ALG and Paul Jacob will be cranking up again for 2008

    Nothing in 2007? There are several states that have odd year initiatives.

  • Julian

    I live in Colorado and the Taxpayer’s Bill of Rights (TABOR)law passed here a few years ago is a joke. It has been gutted and diluted by “creative” politicians with the help of their taxpayer funded expensive lawyers and by the courts. Even the voters voted last year to emasculate it effectively raising their own taxes voluntarily.

    As for the smoking ban, Colorado passed the legislation last year banning smoking virtually everywhere including all bars and restaurants EXCEPT CASINOS!!! Colorado was sued in Federal Court claiming the law was unconstitutional because casinos were exempt and the District Judge ruled in favor of the ban last week. So much for the Constitution and fair play.

    To believe Colorado presents itself as the personal freedom “cowboy” state in ads to attract tourists.

    Only one politician in Colorado stands up for individual freedom, El Paso County Commissioner Doug Bruce and he was called a sociopath and narcissist by El Paso County Attorney last week.

  • paulie cannoli

    Doug Bruce is a cheap fucker, he pays too little on his petitions.

  • Julian

    Paulie Cannoli

    Nothing satisfies you. You can choose to work for Doug Bruce or not. Did he force you to work cheap getting signatures? What a hypocrite. You are truly inconsistent and a dumb he/she bitch.

    Now I know what you do for a living. I believe I have met you in front of a Walmart on 8th St. in Colorado Springs and you were the pushy he/she bitch that I told could shove the petition up his/her ass. You also offered to sell me some meth. Gotcha!

  • paulie cannoli

    Julian, you’re the he/she bitch.

    I don’t sell meth, so stop lying.

    As for who I choose to work with (not for, since I work for myself) that’s my business, not yours.

    Speaking of hypocrites, since you like Bruce so much, why did you tell the petitioner to shove his petitions up his ass? You would think you’d sign, since you like them so much.

    You truly are a mentally damaged peanut brained mental case. as you have admitted.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Crucifying smokers?

    I wouldn’t bother wasting the nails.

  • paulie cannoli

    BTW,

    I’ve only mentioned what I do for a living a few hundred times. It took Julian this long to figure it out? What a peanut brain.

  • TerryP

    Here is a little thought expirement. I just read in the paper from one of the people against 423 (our TABOR) that spending in NE increased on average by 5.4% a year in the last ten years. If you take a base of 100 and increase it by 5.4% a year you will get 170. If say wages, bz income only increases by 3.4% a year you get roughly 140. For a difference of 30%. Let’s say the schools boondoogle us in to thinking they need more money and our spending actually goes up by 4.4% or an increase of about 15% in spending which our property taxes would have to cover. They have gotten people to believe that the increase of 15% covered by property taxes is bad, but an increase in all taxes of 30% is good. How? They never tell the gullable public that taxes will have to increase if spending continues at the pace that it is going. They just plant fear of schools going broke or law enforcement budgets having to be slashed. Why can’t they live within the means of the taxpayers who are paying?

  • TerryP

    I don’t understand why teachers, educational administrators, expect there salaries to go up more than the average wages of the people within the state who are paying their salaries. They expect their salaries to go up even in years of recession when the taxpayers salaries are actually declining. The article also mentioned that the states correction budget had been increasing by 10-15%. Maybe they should be for at least decreasing the War on Drugs which would bring this spending down substantially, freeing up money for education. They mentioned that health care costs ere increasing at above 10% rates. Well maybe they should be for a free market health care system which would invariably bring down costs. For instance 1 GB of memory 1956 $10 million, 1980 $233,000, 1990 $7,700, 2000 $13.30, 2006 $1 (Fast Company). Again freeing up money for other things such as education. Instead they just want to keep up the ever increasing gov’t spending for everything (ie filling their pockets)

  • paulie cannoli

    Terry P,

    Don’t you know that Howie Rich lives in NYC and your property taxes will go up? LOL, what brilliant propaganda.

  • paulie cannoli

    No, no, Terry.

    If 423 passes, our civilization will collapse!

    Also, if we get casinos in Nebraska, we’ll all be slot machine junkies. Never mind the casinos right across the river in Council Bluffs which you can actually see from Lewis and Clark Landing, which have about 80% Nebraska plates in their parking lot.

  • http://www.lpnm.org Joseph Knight

    “We can slow down our approach of principle.”

    I have no problem with incrementalism so long as the incrementalism is in the right direction.

    “We can probably afford to give on a few minor issues in exchange for concessions on major ones.”

    But what’s a “minor” issue? Something that affects somebody else instead of you? I raise a fuss over the “fair” tax because it hurts me personally and now I’m regarded as the “purity police.” True, some things like privatization of infrastructure, isn’t high on my list of priorities but I don’t want to lose sight of where we WANT to go.

    “There are ways to paint ourselves in a more popular light without actually going against principle.”

    YES, NOW you get it!
    http://mail.libertarian-party-nm.org/pipermail/lpnm-forum_libertarian-party-nm.org/2006q4/000638.html

  • disinter

    Speaking of smoking bans.. hyphen lady is a long-time proponent of a smoking ban in Houston.

    http://lonestartimes.com/2006/10/12/butting-in/

  • DAP

    Some history of Omaha and La Cosa Nostra:
    “The man who first organized Omaha crime was the city’s shadowy political boss, Tom Dennison. Dennison was a flinty-eyed frontier gambler from the old school — he ran dance halls in the tough mining towns of Colorado before drifting into rough-and-tumble Omaha around 1891 and setting up a policy game. He soon became known as the city’s “King Gambler” and first entered the political arena around the turn of the century as a way of protecting his interests. Although he never actually held public office, Dennison advanced a “wide-open town” policy in which he acted as a power broker between the business community and the local vice lords. For more than 25 years, his power was such that no crime occurred in the city without his blessing, the police reported to him daily, and the mayor himself answered directly to him. [cont…]

  • DAP

    During the Prohibition era, Dennison developed a working relationship with Al Capone of Chicago and Tom Pendergast of Kansas City. He also formed the Omaha Liquor Syndicate, an organization designed to monopolize the illegal liquor trade in the city. This led to a rash of violence among the city’s bootleggers, which culminated in the December 1931 murder of Harry Lapidus, a prominent businessman and outspoken opponent of the Dennison machine. Although the murder was never solved, few doubted who was ultimately responsible. Public opinion turned against Dennison, and on August 5, 1932, the boss and 58 of his associates were indicted for conspiracy to violate the National Prohibition Act. Dennison was acquitted on all charges, but retired in disgrace. In 1933, his ticket went down to defeat in a local election, and the following year, he died in California at the age of 76.”
    http://www.americanmafia.com/Cities/Omaha.html

  • VW

    When there is a budget shortfall to cover non-essential government services the citizens will be given a choice between higher taxes or the loss of essential government services. –Matt Giwer

  • http://www.voxfux.com/features/bush_child_sex_coverup/WashingtonTimes.htm Matt

    I wonder if there’s any connection between the stuff mentioned in 33 and 34 and the Bush 41 little boy sex scandal. It’s hard to put anything past this crowd.

  • Matt
  • paulie

    I have no problem with incrementalism so long as the incrementalism is in the right direction.

    Exactly!

    DAP, the more things change the more they stay the same…

    nowadays it’s PJ Morgan.

  • undercover_anarchist

    Question: Should workers be exposed to harmful chemcials and carcinogens on the job without government intereference?

    Question: Are public businesses actually “private” with the “right” to mandate separate drinking fountains for colored folk, or to chase them out of the building with broom handles as the “libertarian” Lestor Maddux did in Georgia?

    If the answer to both questions is “YES,” which to the majority of those here it will be, then clearly there is no justification for so-called “smoking bans.”

    And equally clearly, there is no hope for the Libertarian Party ever making signficant inroads in American life.

  • paulie

    Why would you think that the government is the only, or the best, answer to these problems?

  • undercover_anarchist

    I’m just posing the questions, which is rhetorical, since I know the answers.

    Yes, I do feel that workers deserve legislative protection from being exposed to harmful chemcials, and such regulation of state-chartered corporations is entirely appropriate.

    Yes, I do feel that public businesses, particularly corporations, should be barred from discriminating on the basis of race and other criteria spelled out in the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which makes me like 99.999% of all other non-racists in this country.

    “Libertarians” feel differently. These are some of the reasons that the Libertarian Party is hopeless if not for reform-minded moderates, with whom I may strongly disagree on immigration, but on balance, they have my support.

  • http://wesbenedictforlnc.blogspot.com/ Executive Detractor

    Once again, it’s the reformer, Carl Milsted, in 14 who helps to publicize the exrtremists. I’ve actually heard quite a few moderate libertarians say in forums that “libertarians are not anarchists.” Of course, I’m quite sure what instantly goes through the minds of most of the crowd is that “libertarians must be anarchists and they’re trying to hide it.”

    Had they stuck to tax-cutting or getting out of a war, the anarchy label might not have entered the audience’s mind.

    I also hear reformer candidates say “I’m a moderate libertarian” which instantly tells the crowd he is an extremist.

    Like I said before:

    When it comes to promoting the Libertarian Party in a positive light, so often it’s the so-called “moderates” or “reformists” who put the most radical foot forward and then claim “it ain’t mine!”

  • Michael H. Wilson

    U_A where did you get the idea Lester Maddox was a Libertarian?
    M.H.W.

  • Timothy West

    Wes,

    you sound like you’re getting lonely out there.

  • http://www.ballot-access.org Richard Winger

    The Nebraska Libt Party is NOT out of commission. The petition to get it on the ballot for 2008 is almost half finished.

  • Julian

    u_a

    Bullshit analogy of racial discrimination and smoker discrimination. We do not get to choose our race. We do get to choose whether we smoke or not.

    You advocate discriminating against smokers? They come in all colors, sizes, shapes, religious beliefs and sexual orientation.

    I do not smoke but I own guns. I do believe if we screw with the rights of smokers, then they can screw with my right to own a gun.

  • Milford Freeman

    Has Mr. Knight ever been a big advocate of principle?

  • Liberty Crusader

    That’s a very good question, Milford. I think in the early days, yes. But not so much in the past few years, I can CERTAINLY attest to that! I can impart my experiences on the matter to you, if you wish.

  • http://wesbenedictforlnc.blogspot.com/ Executive Detractor

    Timothy West,

    Lonely in Texas? Impossible.

    We’ve got Michael Badnarik, Mike Nelson, Allen Hacker, Eric Dondero, Michelle Shinghal, Bob Smither, and so many more characters whose names I’d rather not tarnish by mentioning on this Jerry Springer blog.

    95% of the infighting in Texas happens on this blog.

    I moderate e-mail groups in Texas where I don’t allow petty bickering. Consequently, lots of work gets done.

    What’s that song with the line “you gotta keep ‘em separated.”

    Once mortal enemies in Texas are separately working to promote the LP because we provide forums for a diverse range of libertarians to organize safely without the constant bickering and back-stabbing, though some still exists.

    That crappy now defunct blog you had was solely dedicated to fomenting internal bickering and to driving out people, though part was admittedly dedicated to promoting bad business decisions. The only people I marginalize or drive out of the LP are the dividers like you.

  • http://wesbenedictforlnc.blogspot.com/ Executive Detractor

    Timothy West, you say the Libertarian Party in West Virginia doesn’t do anything. Once some WV Libertarians said bad things about you, you quit, and now all you do is bitch about all Libertarians.

    Sounds like you’re lonely in West Virginia.

    At this point, I won’t make a West Virginia joke.

    I once lived in Martinsburg, WV, lunched frequently in Charles Town, and worked at the plant in the grand metropolis population 102 city of Middleway with the gas station with the gas pump like 3 feet from the street.

    Life is short. West Virginia is beautiful. How about forgiving any libertarians who’ve done you wrong, accept responsibility for any bad business decisions you helped promote, get off the bickering bandwagon, and become a tolerant and positive voice for whatever it is you want to promote?

  • undercover_anarchist

    MHW, RE: Lester Maddox: Sometimes I have a hard time telling the difference between “white supremacists” and “libertarians,” mostly because the latter has become a euphamism for the former.

    Julian: Of course I’m not comparing racial discrimination to smoker discrimination. That doesn’t even make sense. My point is that the “libertarians” who believe that businesses should be able to say “Whites Only” use the same justification against anti-smoking laws. Is a public business a private club? They think so. So they think that the government has no right to prohibit discrimination OR prohibit worker’s exposure to carcinogens.

    Comparing gun ownership to smoking in public is a similarly stupid comparison. Gun ownership is a means of defense. If you shoot me, you are an aggressor. Spewing toxic fumes into my face as I try to earn a living bussing tables is an aggressive act.

  • Timothy West

    wes,

    thought I did that. You still sound like you wanna fight though.

    I had another medical problem a week or so ago, and I had to ask myself in the hospital if I knew that I was going to have all these problems, would I have spent the last 2 years the same way? The answer of course came back no. It’s been a giant waste of time and effort.

    In any event, I’m out, so why continue bickering? Thats all you’ve done in your last few posts is bitch about reformers.

  • http://www.reformthelp.org Carl

    U_a: regarding comment 15, get real. Prior to the invention of central heating, smoke inhalation has been part of the human condition.

    If the ventilation system is adequate and the ceiling high enough, second hand smoke is no big deal. In an enclosed space (like a a car or airplane) it is. It’s the concentration that counts.

    Since the crackdown on indoor smoking, Asthma rates have gone UP!

    Methinks we have passed the point of diminishing returns on cutting back on second hand smoke. There must be other culprits at work. My guess is overly tight buildings. Household cleaners and air fresheners are also worth investigating.

  • http://www.lpalabama.org/blog/14 paulie

    In Nebraska’s case the actual effect of the new rule has been mostly bars no longer serving food. They can still have smoking so long as they don’t serve food. So, they are closing their kitchens and firing the cooks. So much for the efficacy of political solutions.

  • http://www.frankieandthe4Qs.com Frank Worley

    I’m glad someone picked up this story. Absolute madness. They are heading towards a complete new round of Prohibition and soon it will be prison or “DETOX” for anyone caught with smokes.

    Remember folks Adolf Hitler started this way. (yes, he was the first rabid anti-smoker)

  • http://www.lpalabama.org/blog/14 paulie

    He also started by “winning” an election he actually lost.

    Sounds a lot like W…

  • Liberty Crusader

    Paulie #56…

    In rigged elections, there is no such thing as “winning” or “losing”, in a serious context. Why align yourself with the Democrats for no good reason?

  • http://www.lpalabama.org/blog/14 paulie

    Because a lot of their voters should be ours, and we’ve over-positioned ourselves on the Republican side, cutting off our access to them.

    Also, because it’s true; the last two elections have in fact been rigged by the Republicans, who have gone on to be even worse than typical Duopolists.

  • http://www.lpnm.org Joseph Knight

    “Has Mr. Knight ever been a big advocate of principle?”

    Draw your own conclusions.

    http://mail.libertarian-party-nm.org/pipermail/lpnm-forum_libertarian-party-nm.org/2006q4/000639.html

  • http://www.lpalabama.org/blog/14 paulie

    JK

    Checked email yet?

  • Andy

    “The liberals blocked us libertarian petitioners all over MT, sometimes severely, surrounding us with their Union thugs, and keeping people from signing our petitions.”

    On a previous thread Eric called me a liar for saying that I’ve been harrassed for petitioning by Republicans and I posted several examples of Republicans playing dirty tricks to block petitions that they don’t like. Here’s another example that I neglected to mention.

    I worked on a petition in Florida that the union that had the contract for the Florida prison guards didn’t like. The name of this union is the Florida Police Benevolent Association or PBA. Unions are generally thought of as being for the Democrats, but not these guys, they were Republicans and hardcore Bush supporters. Click the link to see their endorsement of Jeb.

    http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:5op8ZC2IFIAJ:www.bizjournals.com/orlando/stories/2002/07/22/daily53.html+police+benevolent+association+jeb+bush&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=7

  • Andy

    These guys may have been called the Police Benevolent Association, but there was nothing benevolent about them as they were straight up thugs who engaged in the worst (from a petitioners stand point) blocking campaign that I’ve ever seen. They would pop up in their uniforms and shout lies and propaganda and try to intimidate people from signing the petition. They actually followed petitioners after they left the location that they were petitioning at and in fact followed them back to their motel.

    One time myself and another petitioner ran into two of these blockers at this location we were working and I got really pissed off and I let them know what I thought of them. After we left the location these two goons each got into their pick up trucks and started following us. It reminded me of the movie “Mississippi Burning.” We managed to lose them but we wondered if they were going to try to feed us to the gators or something.

    Anyway, the blocking became so bad that the

  • Andy

    proponents actually called the petition drive off. So the crybaby RepubliCON police state thugs got their way.

  • Andy

    On the same previous thread that I mentioned above I posted about a group that was trying to block gambling initiative petitions in Nebrasaka. The group is called Gambling With The Good Life and they are headed by a woman named Pat Loontjer, and (not suprisingly) they are affiliated with Republicans.

    http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:E4dchrRDnJMJ:www.gamblingwiththegoodlife.com/coalit.html+pat+loontjer+republican&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=4

    RepubliCON nanny-state prohibitionists dictating what voluntary activities people can engage. I’d say they need to get a life.

  • Liberty Crusader

    I have researched all and concluded that there is no principle in Mr. Knight, at least not discernibly libertarian in nature.

  • Liberty Crusader

    Paulie:

    If W lost the election, then so did Gore/Kerry.

    If you don’t think Republicans rig elections, then I think you’ve forgotten lessons from Illinois, ’98.

    I, as well as you, petitioned in Illinois subsequently, and I even ran into some of the arrogant bastards instrumental in that electoral rape, prominent state Republicans.

    There are stealing and cheating going on on both mythical “sides” of the Republicrats.

  • Liberty Crusader

    Ooops, Paulie, I got it (ostensibly) backwards. I read the posts really fast and besides, I admit I can’t keep Democrats and Republicans straight. The point is that they are in collusion with each other and both take every single opportunity to cheat by keeping their REAL competition off the ballot and out of the debates. I think it’s true that it’s like wrestling, that it’s really all fake (when it comes to supposed Republican/Democrat “competition”) and that Gore actually AGREED that Bush be decreed the winner – and same with Kerry 4 years later.